| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5] > | Is OpenAI’s Whisper better than Dragon? Thread poster: Hans Lenting
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Michael Beijer 
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
Dan Lucas wrote:
Very sprightly.
Dan
Indeed. It's actually crazy just how sluggish and crap Dragon is once you try something like Talon.
Talon be nimble,
Talon be quick,
Talon jump over the candlestick.
Apart from it working nicely, I literally don't notice any effect on my computer resources. Its dictation mode is a little different than Dragon's, which can take a little getting used to. However, I find that Talon is so fast (as well as accurate) that there is really is no going back after having used it for a number of weeks now.
| | | | Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
Michael Beijer wrote:
As far as I know there isn't a training process. Are you using the beta yet? As far as I know the new hybrid engine (which is only available in the beta) is better than the one in the free edition.
The beta looks to be paid only, at quite a high level.
Not a problem if worth it, but not at that stage yet...
Dan
| | | | Michael Beijer
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
Dan Lucas wrote: Michael Beijer wrote:
As far as I know there isn't a training process. Are you using the beta yet? As far as I know the new hybrid engine (which is only available in the beta) is better than the one in the free edition. The beta looks to be paid only, at quite a high level. Not a problem if worth it, but not at that stage yet... Dan
Ah, OK. I currently have the beta plan (@ £21.50/month). Not entirely sure what the difference is between that and the Professional plan (@ £85/month) though.
| | | | Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
Michael, thanks for your comment on Slack. That test command you tried, did you insert it into an existing file or create your own .talon file and stick it in there? I'm still a bit hazy on the overall structure...
Dan
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Michael Beijer
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
| C:\Users\mbeijer\AppData\Roaming\talon\user\beijer.talon | Jan 27 |
Dan Lucas wrote:
Michael, thanks for your comment on Slack. That test command you tried, did you insert it into an existing file or create your own .talon file and stick it in there? I'm still a bit hazy on the overall structure...
Dan
I keep all my own commands in this file:
C:\Users\mbeijer\AppData\Roaming\talon\user\beijer.talon
Here is the content (hope some of it might help you on your way):
# Comments start with a # sign, and they must always be on their own line.
#
# This part, the context header, defines under which circumstances this file applies.
os: windows
#app: memoQ
# Anything above this (single!) dash is part of the context header.
-
# Anything below the dash is part of the body.
# If there is no dash, then the body starts immediately.
# Add a word to the Custom words list in memoQ by right-cliking and pressing 'a'
add word:
mouse_click(1)
key("a")
# Open this file for editing in VS Code
edit commands:
user.edit_text_file("C:\\Users\\mbeijer\\AppData\\Roaming\\talon\\user\\beijer.talon")
# Launch my pomodoro script
pomodoro:
user.system_command_nb ("D:\\Software\\AutoHotkey\\PomodoroPlus.ahk")
# Search for selected word in dtSearch (triggers AHK script)
search desktop|desktop search:
key("ctrl-shift-d")
# Search for selected word in Google (triggers AHK script)
search google:
key("ctrl-/")
# Search for selected word in Google (triggers AHK script)
google (this|that):
key("ctrl-/")
# Make screenshot with Snagit (triggers AHK)
screenshot:
key("ctrl-alt-x")
replace term:
key("alt-r")
find next:
key("alt-f")
# Add selection to non-translatables in memoQ
non translatable:
key("ctrl-alt-n")
key("enter")
# Add selection to non-translatables in memoQ
non-translatable:
key("ctrl-alt-n")
key("enter")
# insert the next tag in memoQ
next tag:
key("f9")
# split the current segment in memoQ
split segment:
key("alt-t")
# copy source to target in memoQ
source to target:
key("ctrl-shift-s")
key("ctrl-enter")
# confirm the current segment in memoQ
(confirm segment|confirm|next):
key("ctrl-enter")
go to the top:
key("ctrl-home")
# Filter all segments in grid on selected word in memoQ
filter text:
key("ctrl-shift-f")
# Add term pair to my background termbase in memoQ
glossary:
key("alt-down")
# Add term pair to my project termbase in memoQ
project glossary:
key("alt-up")
# Add term pair to my background termbase & project termbase in memoQ
both glossaries:
key(alt-down alt-up)
# Triggers GT4T to translate current segment in memoQ with multiple MT engines
translate this:
key("ctrl-shift-s")
key("ctrl-a")
key("ctrl-g")
# Triggers GT4T to translate selection with multiple MT engines
translate selection:
key("ctrl-g")
# Open my Beijer.bot script
robot:
key("`")
# Print any number in brackets for in patents, like this: (1), (2), (12), etc.
bracket :
insert("({number}) ")
# Insert match number x in memoQ
match :
key("ctrl-{number}")
grab it:
key (ctrl-a)
key (ctrl-c)
# Toggle between source and target box in memoQ grid
switch sides:
key("tab:1")
# Show/hide non-printing characters in memoQ grid
invisible:
key("ctrl-shift-p")
# Show/hide non-printing characters in MS Word
invisible word:
key("ctrl-shift-*")
Note that you need to put a few spaces at the beginning of each line after the initial line of each command. Not sure if it has to be 2 (which is what I use) or if a tab would also suffice.
[Edited at 2024-01-27 09:01 GMT]
| | | | Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
Very generous of you, many thanks. I will study it.
Dan
| | | | Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
Incidentally, one of the reasons that I like to push complex functionality down into autohotkey rather than using the inbuilt functionality of Dragon or Talon is precisely because it makes this kind of migration easier.
AHK isn't going anywhere, and has better resources and community support than Dragon. Whereas Talon is promising, who knows what will happen to the developer over the long term?
So I like to keep my options open, and AHK is an important part of that (eve... See more Incidentally, one of the reasons that I like to push complex functionality down into autohotkey rather than using the inbuilt functionality of Dragon or Talon is precisely because it makes this kind of migration easier.
AHK isn't going anywhere, and has better resources and community support than Dragon. Whereas Talon is promising, who knows what will happen to the developer over the long term?
So I like to keep my options open, and AHK is an important part of that (even though it's a horrible language). I do like the idea of Python in Talon, so I am not completely shutting off the idea of utilizing that side of things, but first and foremost I have to be happy with the recognition and associated stuff.
Dan ▲ Collapse
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Dan Lucas wrote:
Whereas Talon is promising, who knows what will happen to the developer over the long term?
@Michael Beijer
From a cursory look at their EULA, it appears that Talon Voice uses Zero-Clause BSD license. Can you confirm if this was the case? If true, Dan's and my concern would be negated, as someone else can step in to take it over once the current maintainer(s) had lost interest in the project.
Linux / X11 (Ubuntu 18.04+, and most modern distros), Wayland support is currently limited to XWayland
Aww… ☹️
[Edited at 2024-01-28 11:57 GMT]
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Michael Beijer
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
| Zero-Clause BSD license only applies to community contributions (AFAIK) | Jan 31 |
Novian Cahyadi wrote: Dan Lucas wrote:
Whereas Talon is promising, who knows what will happen to the developer over the long term? @Michael Beijer From a cursory look at their EULA, it appears that Talon Voice uses Zero-Clause BSD license. Can you confirm if this was the case? If true, Dan's and my concern would be negated, as someone else can step in to take it over once the current maintainer(s) had lost interest in the project. Linux / X11 (Ubuntu 18.04+, and most modern distros), Wayland support is currently limited to XWayland Aww… ☹️ [Edited at 2024-01-28 11:57 GMT]
As far as I can tell, the Zero-Clause BSD license only applies to community contributions. That is, this stuff: https://github.com/talonhub/community
See the following excerpt from the Talon EULA:
8. Community Contributions
When a Licensee shares with the Talon community "original works" (configurations, voice grammars, documentation, code, and supporting metadata, of which they are the copyright holder), intended for use with Talon, through community features in the Talon app, Talon Slack, or Talon Website: unless these original works are distributed with their own valid software license, the Licensee (you) agrees to license these original works to the Licensor and all Talon users under the terms of the non-restrictive BSD Zero Clause License with the below license text (with year and copyright holder(s) replaced with the release year and the creators' name(s) or alias(es)):
==== Start BSD Zero Clause License ====
Copyright (c)
Permission to use, copy, modify, and/or distribute this software for any purpose with or without fee is hereby granted.
THE SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED "AS IS" AND THE AUTHOR DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES WITH REGARD TO THIS SOFTWARE INCLUDING ALL IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHOR BE LIABLE FOR ANY SPECIAL, DIRECT, INDIRECT, OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES OR ANY DAMAGES WHATSOEVER RESULTING FROM LOSS OF USE, DATA OR PROFITS, WHETHER IN AN ACTION OF CONTRACT, NEGLIGENCE OR OTHER TORTIOUS ACTION, ARISING OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH THE USE OR PERFORMANCE OF THIS SOFTWARE.
===== End BSD Zero Clause License =====
| | | | Michael Beijer
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
| Programs come and go but AHK is likely to be around for the long haul. | Jan 31 |
Dan Lucas wrote:
Incidentally, one of the reasons that I like to push complex functionality down into autohotkey rather than using the inbuilt functionality of Dragon or Talon is precisely because it makes this kind of migration easier.
AHK isn't going anywhere, and has better resources and community support than Dragon. Whereas Talon is promising, who knows what will happen to the developer over the long term?
So I like to keep my options open, and AHK is an important part of that (even though it's a horrible language). I do like the idea of Python in Talon, so I am not completely shutting off the idea of utilizing that side of things, but first and foremost I have to be happy with the recognition and associated stuff.
Dan
I totally agree with you regarding AHK. Programs come and go but AHK is likely to be around for the long haul. It's probably smarter to create all my little scripts in AHK and call them all from in Talon, rather than write them all in Talon.
Incidentally, I'm definitely no expert programmer but as far as I can tell, v2 of AHK is quite an improvement over v1. They seem to have tried to make AutoHotkey less idiosyncratic and messy.
Regarding Python, I recently decided to start learning it (as my first real programming language), since I love its
simplicity and the fact that it is good for NLP, etc. However, I soon realised that most of the stuff I want to be able to do in my daily work as a translator was much easier to achieve in AHK than in Python, so I decided to put Python on hold and focus entirely on AHK (v2). I've even created a small website to track my progress: https://beijer.bot/
| | | | Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
Michael Beijer wrote:
However, I soon realised that most of the stuff I want to be able to do in my daily work as a translator was much easier to achieve in AHK than in Python
My experience exactly. I like Python, and I'm writing a script in it right now to extract a forex time series and apply it to my revenues to back-calculate volume. I would never dream of attempting do that in AHK, but conversely I have tried manipulating Windows and so on in Python, and it was a lot more difficult than in AHK. Horses for courses.
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Michael Beijer wrote: As far as I can tell, the Zero-Clause BSD license only applies to community contributions. That is, this stuff: https://github.com/talonhub/community See the following excerpt from the Talon EULA: [snip]
Thank you for confirming.
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Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
| Gearing up for another go | Mar 20 |
I tried to use Talon for dictation (albeit with the "free" version rather than the beta version) and it didn't go that well, which put me off the idea for a while. It was in the back of my head at the time that I could have achieved better results if I had spent more time customizing things to my liking. Still, I got distracted by orders and nothing came of it.
But then, this morning I was "typing" something with my voice, and it occurred to me that actually Dragon isn't that great ... See more I tried to use Talon for dictation (albeit with the "free" version rather than the beta version) and it didn't go that well, which put me off the idea for a while. It was in the back of my head at the time that I could have achieved better results if I had spent more time customizing things to my liking. Still, I got distracted by orders and nothing came of it.
But then, this morning I was "typing" something with my voice, and it occurred to me that actually Dragon isn't that great either. I have to make regular revisions and changes, just like I did with Talon. It is also quite sluggish (even on this new and fairly speedy notebook), and every now and again it just freezes for about a minute at a time.
And there are so many questionable interface/usability design decisions, like that stupid performance optimization thing that kicks in every now and again when you save the profile, without giving you any choice in the matter, and which takes minutes to complete. I put up with so many annoyances from Dragon, but they have become invisible to me due to the passage of time and because I have always subconsciously assumed there is no alternative.
On top of this, there is still very little sign of forward motion by the developers, and they want several hundred dollars just for an upgrade. So I am again thinking that I might as well give Talon a serious try.
My tentative plan, once this current surge of work is over, is to start building up Talon in parallel to Dragon. That is, try to replicate how I work in Dragon in Talon, even down to the same commands, and also sign up for the beta for a few months. If I go at it steadily, over a span of 3 to 6 months rather than a couple of weeks, it might work.
Dan
[Edited at 2024-03-20 15:20 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Michael Beijer
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
| three quick videos showing Talon (the paid version) at work on my computer! | Mar 20 |
Dan Lucas wrote:
I tried to use Talon for dictation (albeit with the "free" version rather than the beta version) and it didn't go that well, which put me off the idea for a while. It was in the back of my head at the time that I could have achieved better results if I had spent more time customizing things to my liking. Still, I got distracted by orders and nothing came of it.
But then, this morning I was "typing" something with my voice, and it occurred to me that actually Dragon isn't that great either. I have to make regular revisions and changes, just like I did with Talon. It is also quite sluggish (even on this new and fairly speedy notebook), and every now and again it just freezes for about a minute at a time.
And there are so many questionable interface/usability design decisions, like that stupid performance optimization thing that kicks in every now and again when you save the profile, without giving you any choice in the matter, and which takes minutes to complete. I put up with so many annoyances from Dragon, but they have become invisible to me due to the passage of time and because I have always subconsciously assumed there is no alternative.
On top of this, there is still very little sign of forward motion by the developers, and they want several hundred dollars just for an upgrade. So I am again thinking that I might as well give Talon a serious try.
My tentative plan, once this current surge of work is over, is to start building up Talon in parallel to Dragon. That is, try to replicate how I work in Dragon in Talon, even down to the same commands, and also sign up for the beta for a few months. If I go at it steadily, over a span of 3 to 6 months rather than a couple of weeks, it might work.
Dan
[Edited at 2024-03-20 15:20 GMT]
Hi Dan,
I'm happy to hear you haven't given up on Talon! I'm still using it all day long, both for dictation (everywhere on my computer) and in memoQ and elsewhere for commands. I made three quick videos to show you some stuff:
• https://app.screencast.com/gmvHEy6Ra4hlm?conversation=5USIZsTSJzEBkfzMgmKwCq (misc. commands)
• https://app.screencast.com/juAkfkwEerxCo?conversation=FoqNHLvz3F00IuR5WYq37q (memoQ commands)
• https://app.screencast.com/gTOVZ3mdlkpsU?conversation=q8h0TDyDHgcn8qeGuvpRsB (dictation test)
One little tip I can think of is to not dictate overly long sentences with a ton of commas. Just break them up into smaller pieces.
[Edited at 2024-03-20 22:09 GMT]
| | | | Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
Michael Beijer wrote:
One little tip I can think of is to not dictate overly long sentences with a ton of commas. Just break them up into smaller pieces.
Very helpful, thank you for taking the time to do that Michael. Your beard is looking well.
Interestingly I have "brackets one" and so on set up for Dragon, but they are all recorded as individual vocabulary items, which is obviously less efficient. (I think it is certainly possible to do this in Dragon without adding them individually, but it would require futzing around with that silly little editor of theirs. It is also noticeably slower than Talon.)
Good to see a fellow dtSearch user.
The "robot" menu is interesting - I have several times thought about making something similar for PhraseExpress, but never got round to doing it. Seeing your implementation has reminded me that this would be a handy way of accessing particularly URLs and folders that you use a lot. I have most of them mapped to my keyboard, but when I am mousing around I often don't have both hands on the keys.
Overall, I was struck by the similarity of the solutions you have developed to those that I have tackled. For example in Phrase "filter filter" grabs whatever text I have selected and inserts it in the filter bar, which is similar to what you have done with memoQ. Do you constrain that utterance to memoQ in some way or is "filter" rare enough that it does not trigger in other apps?
Dan
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