Glossary entry (derived from question below)
German term or phrase:
Harte Klasse
English translation:
hard class
Added to glossary by
Christine Lam
Oct 27, 2004 00:03
19 yrs ago
German term
Harte Klasse
German to English
Social Sciences
Tourism & Travel
in einem Brief aus dem Jahr 1928 (wird jedoch offenbar heute noch gebraucht)
Ich fuhr ueber Sibirien "Harte Klasse", und bezahlte deshalb fuer meine Reisekarte nur RM 000
Dies scheint eine Art "Grossraum-Schlafwagen" zu sein, bestimmt eine schlechtere Kategorie, aber gibt's dafuer eine bestimmte Bezeichnung?
Ich fuhr ueber Sibirien "Harte Klasse", und bezahlte deshalb fuer meine Reisekarte nur RM 000
Dies scheint eine Art "Grossraum-Schlafwagen" zu sein, bestimmt eine schlechtere Kategorie, aber gibt's dafuer eine bestimmte Bezeichnung?
Proposed translations
(English)
Proposed translations
+2
6 hrs
Selected
hard class
sorry - but it's as easy as that!
by contrast with "soft class:
cf. www.concourse.net/bus/wnights/Trans-Siberian.html
I know this from MY travels, in both China and Russia
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Note added at 2004-10-27 08:14:30 (GMT)
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\"hard class\" was wooden seats (hard on the backside!) and soft class was padded seats......
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Note added at 2004-10-27 09:20:40 (GMT)
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I would even go as far as saying that there is every likelihood that the German was a translation from the the English in the first place!
by contrast with "soft class:
cf. www.concourse.net/bus/wnights/Trans-Siberian.html
I know this from MY travels, in both China and Russia
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Note added at 2004-10-27 08:14:30 (GMT)
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\"hard class\" was wooden seats (hard on the backside!) and soft class was padded seats......
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Note added at 2004-10-27 09:20:40 (GMT)
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I would even go as far as saying that there is every likelihood that the German was a translation from the the English in the first place!
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "thank you so much for everyone's input. If it really is as simple as that, I will go with this option."
+2
20 mins
Dmytro Voskolovych
I worship professionalism
Native in: Russian 
, Ukrainian
Works in: English to Russian, German to Russian, English to Ukrainian, and 1 more.
second class coach
Talking about Russian: actually it's called not "platzkartnii" but rather "obshchij" which is literally "common". In such a coach there are no separate compartments and it is packed with people, sleeping on hard berths (sometimes three berths high). So i guess that is what is called second class coach
www.semg.org.uk/coach/codes.html
The following codes come from instructions dated August 1954 and June 1960. It must be borne in mind that *third class was abolished in 1956, at which time all Third Class (T) became Second Class (S)*.
www.semg.org.uk/coach/codes.html
The following codes come from instructions dated August 1954 and June 1960. It must be borne in mind that *third class was abolished in 1956, at which time all Third Class (T) became Second Class (S)*.
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Robert Schlarb
: Why not third class then, if the description goes back to 1928?
6 hrs
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that my be as well, thanks!
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| agree |
shabda
9 hrs
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thank you!
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+4
12 mins
Hilary Davies Shelby
United States
United States
Native in English
Works in field
United States
German and "Geek" to English!
Native in: English
Works in: German to English, English
Related KudoZ points
:
8
"platzkartnij/platzkartnii/platzkartniy"
I know you are looking for the English term - I don't know it either, but I know this is what it is called in Russian - maybe Googling that would help? (And yes they do still have it, I travelled "platzkartnij" from Moscow to Tallin in 1986). It's a third-class carriage full of bunk beds!
Hope this helps ;-)
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Note added at 14 mins (2004-10-27 00:18:03 GMT)
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oops - I mean in 1996 - not that it really matters! ;-)
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Note added at 25 mins (2004-10-27 00:29:02 GMT)
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Also \"platzkarta/platskarta\" - \"platzkartnij\" is the adjectival form.
I\'ve just managed to find a picture of one on someone\'s web site for you - as you\'ll see it\'s very narrow, with 3 levels of bunk beds, and everyone talks to each other and shares food...
http://www.zpok.hu/~fjoo/carszko5.jpg
Hope this helps ;-)
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Note added at 14 mins (2004-10-27 00:18:03 GMT)
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oops - I mean in 1996 - not that it really matters! ;-)
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Note added at 25 mins (2004-10-27 00:29:02 GMT)
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Also \"platzkarta/platskarta\" - \"platzkartnij\" is the adjectival form.
I\'ve just managed to find a picture of one on someone\'s web site for you - as you\'ll see it\'s very narrow, with 3 levels of bunk beds, and everyone talks to each other and shares food...
http://www.zpok.hu/~fjoo/carszko5.jpg
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Laurel Porter (X)
: Perhaps if Christine can't find a specific English term, she could use the Russian with a parenthetical explanation such as "the train equivalent of steerage"...
2 mins
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| agree |
sonja29 (X)
2 hrs
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| agree |
Norbert Hermann
: I would call it 3rd class
7 hrs
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| agree |
Mario Marcolin
: 3rd class. BTW this kind of class was common all over Europe until WWII at least :)
16 hrs
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+1
27 mins
Obschij vagon
Plackartnij might be, but obschij is a worse typy of carriage, where you have to sit and can not lay down, there are usually a lot of people and those carriages usually do not go for a very long distance. That is what I think Harte Klasse might be.
-1
1 hr
Cattle class
I think 'harte klasse' is colloquial. 'Cattle class' could be the equivalent, or maybe 'rough class'.
Peer comment(s):
| disagree |
Hilary Davies Shelby
: I feel that "cattle class" could have very negative connotations, makes me think of people being transported in cattle trucks
1 hr
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so does 'harte klasse' IMO...
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2 hrs
Dr. Fred Thomson
United States
United States
Native in English
United States
A lawyer, technician, nuclear power optr
Native in: English
Works in: German to English
Related KudoZ points
:
26
harsh class or austere class or lowest possible class
There may be no precise standard translation. You may have to use a descriptive term such as "lowest possible class" or "peasant class."
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Hilary Davies Shelby
: not "peasant class", please! People DO actually travel in these things!
36 mins
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Context must be considered, Hilary. This was 1928.
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3 hrs
Mary McCusker
Native in English
Works in field
Excellence combined with speed
Native in: English
Works in: German to English, French to English, Dutch to English
steerage
This is the term used, for example, for immigrants coming to the US by boat in previous centuries. Accommodation was usually in large, overcrowded spaces in the hold of the ship. 'Steerage' still used jokingly to denote economy class on planes.
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