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Glossary entry

Dutch term or phrase:

minnelijke expertise

English translation:

out-of-court expert or amicable expert

Added to glossary by DebbieKleynhans
Nov 8, 2011 10:26
12 yrs ago
5 viewers *
Dutch term

minnelijke expertise

Dutch to English Law/Patents Architecture
Hi all

I am translating a CV and one sentence is as follows: 'Technisch raadgever bij diverse gerechtelijke, minnelijke en andere expertises'. I found another thread on 'medische expertises' and assume that 'gerechtelijke expertise' would be 'legal expert opinion' or 'legal assessment' but I am struggling with 'minnelijke expertise' - I found this useful website explaining it (http://www.bouwexperten.be/exp_minnelijk.html) but am not sure how that would be translated.

Thanks in advance!
Proposed translations (English)
4 +1 out-of-court expert or amicable expert
4 -1 arbitration case
4 -1 mediation expertise
3 assessment out of court
References
The internet...
Change log

Jan 9, 2012 17:22: DebbieKleynhans Created KOG entry

Discussion

sindy cremer Nov 8, 2011:
Your note left room for interpretation. Other people might read more or less into it than you intended. This had better be avoided in legalese questions. Hence my remarks.
As for the 'technisch raadgever', please read my refs for the difference between this person and the one conducting the 'deskundigenonderzoek'. A 'technisch raadgever' is hired by one party; impartiality on his part is not required; his role is to assist 'his' party.
This, too, is important for future reference.
Finally, I would agree with your suggestion, with the addition of 'expert', hence 'out-of-court expert assessment'.
Kirsten Bodart Nov 8, 2011:
@Sindy No, the expert is not 'employed' by the court as in 'working for as an employee', but he is employed as in 'used' or as you say appointed by the court. My husband just confirmed 'employ' could be used in such a way and he is native UK English. Secondly, this expertise is a report that such an expert makes, upon which in this case a settlemnt out of court will be based. How do you otherwise read 'technich raadgever bij minnelijke expertise'. As a native speaker it is clear to me that the person was a technical advisor for such assessments out of court. How does it make a difference which role he performs during such a procedure?
And yes, expertise can also mean 'skills' like we as translators put on our profile, but I do consider it clear that none of that applies here. How otherwise does the meaning fit in Dutch?
I have had such an expert assessing my problem as well, so I know very well how things work. Such a technical expert is de facto hired by the two arguing parties to assess the problem, but still appointed by the court. Both parties can independently also hire their own or have a counter assessment made, so it is possible that this refers to one and the same person.
sindy cremer Nov 8, 2011:
Phil Yup, a NL-EN question, hence proper understanding of the Dutch term is required. I did not use 'expertise' in an English context, hence the quotation marks.
philgoddard Nov 8, 2011:
Sindy This is a Dutch to English question, not English to Dutch. You say "expertise" in this context, we don't.
sindy cremer Nov 8, 2011:
@ Phil As a native speaker of Dutch, I assure you that the 'expertise' will be carried out by someone who is skilled in a particular field. A medical expert, for instance, or an expert in civil engineering.
philgoddard Nov 8, 2011:
No, in this case it has nothing to do with skills. Please take it from me as a native speaker! It means a report produced by an expert adviser - for example a loss adjuster's report for an insurance company.
sindy cremer Nov 8, 2011:
@ Kirsten2 'Expertise' has everything to do with 'skills', see e.g. http://www.vlaamseingenieurskamer.be/site/files/I-Mag 2005 -...
sindy cremer Nov 8, 2011:
@ Kirsten Sorry, have to react to the note you added to your initial suggestion:

'Experts in a minnelijke schikking' are independent persons; they are not 'employed by the courts' as you state. They can be appointed by the court (the same applies to the expert in a 'minnelijke expertise', see http://www.expertisen.be/home.htm).
Furthermore, 'technisch raadgevers' fulfil a different role (see http://www.ordomedic.be/nl/adviezen/advies/onafhankelijkheid... :
"Een partij kan, tijdens een onderhandeling, tijdens het zoeken naar een oplossing voor een geschil of tijdens een expertise aan een man van het vak vragen haar bij te staan om haar belangen te verdedigen en ondertussen ook technische uitleg te geven. Een vakman die op die manier in dienst genomen werd door een partij wordt “technisch raadgever” genoemd. Aangezien hij in dienst is van een partij moet hij niet onafhankelijk zijn ten opzichte van deze laatste."

Proposed translations

+1
15 mins
Selected

out-of-court expert or amicable expert

Out-of-court experts are often used in out-of-court alternative dispute resolutions (ADR), as well.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 21 mins (2011-11-08 10:48:00 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

With this said, I would use out-of-court or amicable expertise
Peer comment(s):
agree F Scott Ophof (X) : From GWIT: A 'minnelijke schikking' is an 'amicable/out-of-court settlement', so this person seems to be an expert in such. I would make it 'expertise', not just 'expert'.
5 hrs
neutral philgoddard : You can't use "expertise" like this in English.
6 hrs
I think what F Schott Ophoff referred to is that his area of expertise is amicable / out-of-court settlements see: "http://books.google.com/books?id=6eoBTqHI_TUC&q=out-of-court...
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thank you very much for your help!"
-1
4 hrs

arbitration case

It's explained in Helen's very helpful reference - the two sides don't want to go to court, so they appoint an independent arbitrator.

An "expertise" is an assessment or valuation by an independent expert, but "expert" is not used nearly as often in English as it is in other languages.
Peer comment(s):
disagree sindy cremer : Arbitration is not the same as 'minnelijke expertise'. Pls see my refs.
4 hrs
A "minnelijke expertise" is a report produced for an arbitration case.
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-1
5 hrs

mediation expertise

Arbitration is a formal process, often in lieu of a court case, for more serious disputes, usually involving groups of people. The arbitrator is usually appointed from higher up and has considerable power to force an agreement if necessary.

In companies, as would be the case here, there is a more informal way of resolving disputes, called mediation. This can be as simple as two people sitting down with an impartial third party to help them sort out their differences. The mediator can be assigned or can be chosen by the two parties.
Reference:

http://www.ag.gov.bc.ca/dro/publications/bulletins/process.htm

Peer comment(s):
disagree philgoddard : Mediation, yes; expertise, no. Expertise means skill in English. Here we're talking about a report provided as part of an arbitration or mediation case.
1 hr
Phil, can you explain why not? So 'an expertise' means 'a report'? One learns something new every day - thanks.
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8 mins

assessment out of court

Not really sure, but a 'minnelijke schikking' is a settlement out of court. So he does assessments for the court, when such an argument has reached the stage of a court case, and then he does them out of court if a party has a problem with his/her contractor, but still wants to settle the matter out of court. Or that is how I understand it.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 hrs (2011-11-08 16:52:23 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I think there is a little confusion about what this person means. An 'expertise' is an assessment that carreis legal truth, which is the basis for any rulings made about the matter. Such experts are employed by the courts, but also in private matters. A settlement out of court, therefore, can also involve such an expert whose conclusions from such an assessment will be the basis for any money paid from the one party to the other. So expertise has nothing to do with skills and one cannot be an expert at out of court settlements. That's why it says 'technisch raadgever' 'technical advisor' or something along those lines in such events.
Peer comment(s):
agree Alexander Schleber (X) : my take too.
11 mins
Thanks!
disagree F Scott Ophof (X) : The answer does not take 'expertise' into account.
5 hrs
neutral philgoddard : I agree totally with your explanation, and F Scott Ophoff is wrong.
8 hrs
Something went wrong...

Reference comments

8 hrs
Reference:

The internet...

offers extensive information on 'minnelijke expertise'. A few examples:

http://books.google.be/books?id=gHO65opLD-UC&pg=PA3&lpg=PA3&...

"Het minnelijk deskundigenonderzoek is dit waartoe één of meerdere belanghebbenden vrijwillig overgaan zonder de officiële tussenkomst van de rechter in de aanstelling van de deskundige. Het wordt soms genoemd een 'vrijwillig' of 'buitengerechtelijk' deskundigenonderzoek."

--------
http://www.expertisen.be/home.htm

"... kan een geneesheer eenzijdig door de schadelijdende partij aangesproken worden. Deze minnelijke expertise strekt louter tot informatie en advies van wie erom vraagt. De bevindingen van de expert kunnen derhalve niet aan derden tegengeworpen worden.
(...)
Wordt de geneesheer daarentegen door alle betrokken partijen in der minne aangezocht, worden de vaststellingen contradictoir. De bewijskracht van het expertiseverslag is in beginsel deze van een gerechtelijke expertise. De bewoordingen ervan mogen derhalve niet geschonden worden. Het advies van de expert is echter ten aanzien van de betrokken partijen enkel bindend, wanneer dezen vooraf overeenkwamen zich hierdoor gebonden te verklaren. Dit bindend advies is echter nog geen arbitrage, vermits de expert het geschil als zodanig niet beslecht."

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See also: http://www.elfri.be/minnelijke-expertise
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For'eenvoudige minnelijke expertise' and 'beslissende of onherroepelijke expertise' see: http://www.ordomedic.be/nl/adviezen/advies/onafhankelijkheid...

------------
http://books.google.nl/books?id=GpfWcF7EdAcC&pg=PA26&lpg=PA2...
------
Expertise = deskundigenonderzoek and is not the equivalent of "arbitrage" see the above references and, e.g.:

http://books.google.nl/books?id=GpfWcF7EdAcC&pg=PA10&lpg=PA1...

"Hierin verschilt de arbitrage wezenlijk van de minnelijke expertise die zich dikwijls beperkt tot vaststellingen, en van de bindende derdenbeslissing."

http://books.google.nl/books?id=MlRPepJOJosC&pg=PA176&lpg=PA...

"Arbitrage is ongetwijfeld de meest bekende vorm van geschillenbeslechting, die soms wordt verward met andere rechtsfiguren zoals de expertise, ..."
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