| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | Quality at it's best - error in agency brochure Thread poster: Margaret Schroeder
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| Whhhhat I shhhhuld dddo | Jun 15, 2003 |
Why don't write a simpe e-mail to the owner of Web site or to the agency and point out this kind of error/mistake/typo?
This solution would be less time consuming (and useful)
| | | | | Nobody´s perfect | Jun 15, 2003 |
Sure, we all make the occasional mistake or typographical error in a posting in a mailing list or newsgroup, or a letter to our aunt, or even occasionally in a translation job. BUT the difference here is that the mistake occurs precisely in the company's advertisement, which is supposed to be a showcase of the quality that a prospective client can expect.
Let me try and make my point clear. If I invited you to my house for supper, and my dog jumped all over you and I served you a ba... See more Sure, we all make the occasional mistake or typographical error in a posting in a mailing list or newsgroup, or a letter to our aunt, or even occasionally in a translation job. BUT the difference here is that the mistake occurs precisely in the company's advertisement, which is supposed to be a showcase of the quality that a prospective client can expect.
Let me try and make my point clear. If I invited you to my house for supper, and my dog jumped all over you and I served you a badly cooked meal, you wouldn't necessarily think I was a bad translator. After all not everybody has well-behaved pets. Not everybody is a gourmet cook. But what if I wasn't a translator, but a dog obedience trainer? You'd think twice about using my services, wouldn't you? Or on the other hand, if I was claiming to be an excellent caterer... would you believe it after eating my burnt and tasteless offering? ▲ Collapse
| | | | invguy 
Bulgaria
Local time: 15:06
English to Bulgarian
| Two very different issues here... | Jun 15, 2003 |
One is a translation agency affording an obvious language mistake in its own promotion materials.
Well, IMHO *that* is a no-no. In line with what GoodWords wrote: if the mistake was in the brochure of, say, a local computer retailer, I might not even pay attention to it... I mean, it would be just as wrong, but I wouldn't necessarily relate it to the quality of the computer I'd buy from them. However, in the case of a translation agency, *one* such mistake is enough to leave you dou... See more One is a translation agency affording an obvious language mistake in its own promotion materials.
Well, IMHO *that* is a no-no. In line with what GoodWords wrote: if the mistake was in the brochure of, say, a local computer retailer, I might not even pay attention to it... I mean, it would be just as wrong, but I wouldn't necessarily relate it to the quality of the computer I'd buy from them. However, in the case of a translation agency, *one* such mistake is enough to leave you doubtful about its professional standards. Im my language we call that "the spoon of tar in the keg of honey"
Then, we have the 'native speakers' issue.
No doubt, native speakers do have a better feeling of a language by default. 'Feeling' and 'command' are not the same thing, though. In order to have good *command* of a language, one needs to have dedicated a significant portion of one's time and efforts to that.
One more thing to mention: when one writes in a foreign language, one tends to be more careful about grammar, punctuation, phrasing etc. (Admittedly, this often results in a more 'bookish' style.) OTOH native speakers - especially those who are not professionally involved with their language - are often subconsciously inclined to write as they speak... so there's always the risk of inadvertently letting such 'written colloquialisms' slip in here and there.
And yep, every one of us *is* a native speaker of at least one language... no?
My 2 cents.
P.S. As a matter of fact, in the case quoted by GoodWords, it might be just a last-minute mistake of whoever did the prepress on the brochure. Prepress folks are not known for their excellent grammar & spelling... I know, I'm basically a graphic designer myself
Besides, with designers there's the phenomenon I call "text-as-graphics syndrome". As soon as you type in a text, you start viewing it only as a graphic element. You might tweak it, fiddle with it, change font, size, colour and whatnot, and still remain blind for some obvious mistake. Been there, done that... This is why the client should *always* proofread the *final* version of the file, immediately before it goes to film.
To clarify: I'm not justifying that agency's mistake, just reflecting on some of the possible reasons for it. It's always good to have clarity about the reasons... only then one could eventually do something about the problem.
Hmmm... that would total up to 4 cents, I guess... ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Non-native English is frequently worse | Jun 15, 2003 |
I'm cursed with a good proofreader's eye. Since I'm looking for work with an agency as a way of getting myself established, I've seen quite a few websites of RussianEnglish translation agencies where the English is, umm, rather nonstandard? Grammar errors, spelling errors, typos, and all sorts of things. Nasty, embarrassing, and the worst thing about it is that they aren't embarrassed enough by such things.
And I agree with all of you - grammar or spelling errors, especially of... See more I'm cursed with a good proofreader's eye. Since I'm looking for work with an agency as a way of getting myself established, I've seen quite a few websites of RussianEnglish translation agencies where the English is, umm, rather nonstandard? Grammar errors, spelling errors, typos, and all sorts of things. Nasty, embarrassing, and the worst thing about it is that they aren't embarrassed enough by such things.
And I agree with all of you - grammar or spelling errors, especially of the "its" vs. "it's" variety, are absolutely inexcusable in a translation agency's website. If they produce that kind of English, what will they do with your document? Language is what they have to show - it had better be perfect.
LM ▲ Collapse
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sylver
Local time: 20:06
English to French
| Just a question... | Jun 16, 2003 |
I was under the impression that we were talking about a typo at the end of a brochure.
Is that a flyer with a couple lines? (which does not qualify for the term "brochure") or is it over 5 pages of text/graphic?
In a flyer, indeed, I would tend to agree that 1 typo is just not acceptable, but if we are talking about a bona fides brochure, please give 'em a break.
Is there anyone here ready to garantee that his output is always 100% perfect, with perfectly a... See more I was under the impression that we were talking about a typo at the end of a brochure.
Is that a flyer with a couple lines? (which does not qualify for the term "brochure") or is it over 5 pages of text/graphic?
In a flyer, indeed, I would tend to agree that 1 typo is just not acceptable, but if we are talking about a bona fides brochure, please give 'em a break.
Is there anyone here ready to garantee that his output is always 100% perfect, with perfectly adequate style (Which is MUCH more important then grammatical rules) and etc.?
Some folks really should have a good look at themselves before they emit such severe judgements over a trivial typo at the end of several pages of text.
I would be very pleased if this "lighter side of trans/interp" forum was actually used to spread light hearted news and jokes, instead of harsh criticism and covert self promotion.
Back to the brighter side of the force, I am sitting in a cyber cafe in bkk and I see they have printed travel flyers. Let me see...
Ah! Here we go. The real stuff:
"Banquet and conference: The Resort offers 3 conference rooms with the full necessary equipment and an experience banquet team that make your function been successfull and memorable."
"Big Buddha, the traditional architecture for your lasting impressions."
And it goes on and on. Laughing is definitely part of the Thailand experience.
Cheers,
Sylvain ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Could be a printing error... | Jun 16, 2003 |
I have personally experienced the challenges of having material printed/incorporated into a website in a country where the language I was dealing with was not the native tongue. There is always a "helpful" proofreader or web developer who wants to "fix" your "mistakes" to make your text "better" before printing...
I am not sure what country Chenoumi's agency is in, but this could be what happened. I say to err is human!
Regards,
Sara
| | | | Marc P (X)
Local time: 14:06
German to English
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Confusion between "its" and "it's" is a common error among native English speakers with a poor knowledge of English grammar. This does not make it any more excusable in a translation. Quite the reverse: precisely because it is so common, it has the effect of announcing the writer's ignorance to the reader. It is what is known as a "howler". The agency could equally have written "We don't never make no mistakes".
Some years ago, a grammar school in England decided to have some mugs p... See more Confusion between "its" and "it's" is a common error among native English speakers with a poor knowledge of English grammar. This does not make it any more excusable in a translation. Quite the reverse: precisely because it is so common, it has the effect of announcing the writer's ignorance to the reader. It is what is known as a "howler". The agency could equally have written "We don't never make no mistakes".
Some years ago, a grammar school in England decided to have some mugs produced bearing the name of the school, as a fund-raising exercise. Unfortunately, the name of the school appeared on the mugs not as "... Grammar School" but as "... Grammer School". What happened? The story made the TV news, folks - that's where I saw it.
Buried in the technical data in the back of an instruction manual for a non-consumer product, confusion between "its" and "it's" might simply raise the odd eyebrow. In a printed advertising brochure, it could easily justify the pulping of an entire print run. In publicity material for professional writers, it ranks alongside Windows 98 crashing as Bill Gates demonstrates it in front of millions of TV viewers.
Marc ▲ Collapse
| | | | | far beyond reproach | Jun 16, 2003 |
Elías Sauza wrote:
True. It is inexcusable, unacceptable, but humans make mistakes. Still, I think it's only a mistake, not an error, because I'm sure the author knows the rules. Even in some of the greatest pieces of literarure we find similar human mistakes... but that was not my point in the posting above anyhow...
I agree with you and keep thinking about an old saying. It is not really a quote, but it
goes something like this:
There is nobody so far beyond reproach that you could not find a way to prove his/her inadequacy.
If this is the only mistake on the web site then it is no more than a funny slip. Yes, I would apply to this agency (and maybe add a short friendly note about the little oversight).
A sense of humor works a lot better than righteous indignation - in business and linguistics and life and ....
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DGK T-I
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:06
Georgian to English
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| On a lighter note......... | Jun 16, 2003 |
sylver wrote:
I was under the impression that we were talking about a typo at the end of a brochure.
Is that a flyer with a couple lines? (which does not qualify for the term "brochure") or is it over 5 pages of text/graphic?
In a flyer, indeed, I would tend to agree that 1 typo is just not acceptable, but if we are talking about a bona fides brochure, please give 'em a break.
Is there anyone here ready to garantee that his output is always 100% perfect, with perfectly adequate style (Which is MUCH more important then grammatical rules) and etc.?
Some folks really should have a good look at themselves before they emit such severe judgements over a trivial typo at the end of several pages of text.
I would be very pleased if this "lighter side of trans/interp" forum was actually used to spread light hearted news and jokes, instead of harsh criticism and covert self promotion.
Back to the brighter side of the force, I am sitting in a cyber cafe in bkk and I see they have printed travel flyers. Let me see...
Ah! Here we go. The real stuff:
"Banquet and conference: The Resort offers 3 conference rooms with the full necessary equipment and an experience banquet team that make your function been successfull and memorable."
"Big Buddha, the traditional architecture for your lasting impressions."
And it goes on and on. Laughing is definitely part of the Thailand experience.
Cheers,
Sylvain
In Britain green-grocers (independent fruit and veg. sellers) have always been famous for putting extra apostrophes in their signs, and it long ago became such a tradition that many took to doing it deliberately - for fun. Not that I'm suggesting that this was a self conscious imitation of the style of a British green-grocer's sign - although, come to think of it, in Britain good green-grocers are highly respected and held in great affection......and we live in a world of surprizing retro advertizing strategies and subtle allusions.......
Oh, and, I'm with Sara, Ursula & Kay on this one
[Edited at 2003-06-17 15:31]
| | | | two2tango
Argentina
Local time: 09:06
Member
English to Spanish
+ ...
after time, TIME magazine makes the same grammatical mistake. Would you believe it?Surely they have very good proofers, but inevitably the same mistake keeps on cropping up. *it´s* which should be *its* is a very common mistake among native speakers. Inexcusable in a translator.
Haydée
| | | | Kay Fisher (X)
German to English
+ ...
Sara Freitas-Maltaverne wrote:
I have personally experienced the challenges of having material printed/incorporated into a website in a country where the language I was dealing with was not the native tongue. There is always a "helpful" proofreader or web developer who wants to "fix" your "mistakes" to make your text "better" before printing...
I am not sure what country Chenoumi's agency is in, but this could be what happened. I say to err is human!
Regards,
Sara
It happens. I spotted several spelling mistakes on my own website only after it went online, despite the text being proofed 3 times (by 3 different people). I had the website done for me and I'm sure some of the errors crept in when the text which was supplied in a word file was transferred to the html files, because most of the mistakes would even have been spotted by word's spellchecker.
Not being familiar with html, I now have to go back to the ad agency who did the site and ask them to make the corrections, or spend probably two days figuring out how to change the files and upload them.
So, the site is online with a few mistakes, for now, until I get them ironed out.
Maybe this is also the case for the site mentioned here.
BTW, a couple of people have written and pointed out the mistakes in my site (in a polite and friendly way) and I was pleased to hear from them.
Right, you're all off to my site now to spot mistakes I bet...
| | | | Thierry LOTTE
Local time: 14:06
Member (2001)
English to French
+ ...
| Cmon' Sandra | Jun 18, 2003 |
I agree with Sylver :
This is not so dramatic !
We shall overcome it !
Translators should not appear as "Ayatollah"...
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Giles Watson
Italy
Local time: 14:06
Italian to English
In memoriam | It's/Its a mistake, but also a "shibboleth" | Jun 18, 2003 |
The apostrophe is only a spelling convention but its misuse is seen by many native and non-native speakers as a literacy marker, or "shibboleth" to distinguish the educated from the illiterate.
Here's what lexicographer Robert Burchfield wrote about it in his marvellous 1985 book, "The English Language" (published by Oxford University Press - recommended!):
- The prevalence of incorrect instances of the use of the apostrophe at the present time, even in the work of othe... See more The apostrophe is only a spelling convention but its misuse is seen by many native and non-native speakers as a literacy marker, or "shibboleth" to distinguish the educated from the illiterate.
Here's what lexicographer Robert Burchfield wrote about it in his marvellous 1985 book, "The English Language" (published by Oxford University Press - recommended!):
- The prevalence of incorrect instances of the use of the apostrophe at the present time, even in the work of otherwise well-educated people (e.g. it's wings, apple's for sale, this is your's), together with the abandonment of it by many business firms (Barclays Bank, Lloyds Bank), suggest that the time is close at hand when this moderately useful device should be abandoned. -
Although, as Dr. Burchfield says, the convention perhaps "should" be abandoned, its social role as a literacy marker is still important, if not quite as crucial as the inability to pronounce the "sh" in "shibboleth".
According to the book of Judges, that little error cost forty two thousand Ephraimites their lives.
Cheers,
Giles ▲ Collapse
| | | | medical (X)
English to Spanish
+ ...
| Dear Thierry | Jun 18, 2003 |
Thierry LOTTE wrote:
I agree with Sylver :
This is not so dramatic !
We shall overcome it !
Translators should not appear as "Ayatollah"...
You are right, I feel very sad when I read people so angry about a mistake, everybody makes mistakes always and we are not the "Inquisición" things in this life must be done with elegance. If we see a mistake in a page, we can friendly send a email to inform the webmaster but not here in the forum, it is like "jetter les chrétiens au lions".
Have a nice day.
María
| | | | Dyran Altenburg (X)
United States
Local time: 08:06
English to Spanish
+ ...
...on the one hand, we have those who think it's bad form for a translation agency to boast of linguistic perfection when they're clearly not perfect. And on the other hand we have those who think mediocrity is ok because after all, we're only human and prone to make mistakes, so let's be proud of it, and sprinkle it with who-are-we-to-judge remarks and all.
Nice.
[Edited at 2003-06-18 19:51]
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