Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
..qui ressemble au vin nouveau ou quand il entre dans l'endroit ou il bout
English translation:
resembling new wine (or) when it begins to ferment
Added to glossary by
Odette Grille (X)
May 22, 2007 22:43
16 yrs ago
French term
..qui ressemble au vin nouveau ou quand il entre dans l'endroit ou il bout
French to English
Art/Literary
Wine / Oenology / Viticulture
18th c ms, travelogue, dictated and handwritten
I do not understand "bout" in this context, but maybe it is because I don't know anything about wine-making. The complete sentence is "Nous fimes fausse routte ce jour paraport à ce que la boussolle qui ressemble au vin nouveau ou quand il entre dans l'endroit ou il bout;"
The gist of the text that follows is that a young woman sitting near the compass on this ship made it go haywire. The transcriptionist of this ms wrote a note saying that young women and menstruating women were thought to "faire surir le vin nouveau" and "dérégler une boussole".
The man who dictated this is Parisian, and the ship departed from Le Havre.
The gist of the text that follows is that a young woman sitting near the compass on this ship made it go haywire. The transcriptionist of this ms wrote a note saying that young women and menstruating women were thought to "faire surir le vin nouveau" and "dérégler une boussole".
The man who dictated this is Parisian, and the ship departed from Le Havre.
Proposed translations
(English)
| 3 +2 | resembling new wine (or) when it begins to ferment |
Odette Grille (X)
|
| 3 | which is similar to new wine when it enters the place where it boils/bubbles |
Drmanu49
|
| 1 | Where water is boiling ... |
Bourth (X)
|
Change log
May 24, 2007 02:16: Odette Grille (X) Created KOG entry
Proposed translations
+2
37 mins
Selected
resembling new wine (or) when it begins to ferment
] LE PATOIS DE VEREL DE MONTBEL (SAVOIE) Format de fichier: PDF/Adobe Acrobat
belyi v bouillir (ou plus exactement fermenter, en parlant du vin). i fèrmantè, ..... la couleur. pe fòr d la nyôla : pour faire de la gnole. ...
members.aol.com/conflans2/P_VM.pdf -
But the sentence still does not make much sense
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Note added at 11 hrs (2007-05-23 10:04:44 GMT)
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We would need more context (the end of that phrase, for example) to know why this compass is compared to a piquette...
belyi v bouillir (ou plus exactement fermenter, en parlant du vin). i fèrmantè, ..... la couleur. pe fòr d la nyôla : pour faire de la gnole. ...
members.aol.com/conflans2/P_VM.pdf -
But the sentence still does not make much sense
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Note added at 11 hrs (2007-05-23 10:04:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
We would need more context (the end of that phrase, for example) to know why this compass is compared to a piquette...
Note from asker:
| hmm, this is what I am thinking, that it actually means "ferment" in this context. This sentence has had me groaning for some time. Thanks for your input! |
| Thank you again, I think I'll go with this. |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Tony M
: Yes, 'bouillir' was, and is still, used for the bubbling action of fermenting. So this must be the 'wine when it goes into the fermenting place' (= vat! but perhaps the person didn't know that term). I think the 1st 'il' is in fact referring to the person
6 hrs
|
| agree |
Mark Nathan
9 hrs
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "A really difficult passage. Thank you all for your ideas."
6 mins
which is similar to new wine when it enters the place where it boils/bubbles
the source sentence doesn't make much sense...
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Note added at 18 minutes (2007-05-22 23:01:29 GMT)
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Produits du Terroir de la Savoie Haute Savoie, les boissons : le Vin de Savoie, ... La Chèvre Breuvage mousseux des régions viticoles, dont la composition ...
www.savoiehautesavoie.com/produits-du-terroir/boissons-177/ - 30k
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Note added at 18 minutes (2007-05-22 23:01:29 GMT)
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Produits du Terroir de la Savoie Haute Savoie, les boissons : le Vin de Savoie, ... La Chèvre Breuvage mousseux des régions viticoles, dont la composition ...
www.savoiehautesavoie.com/produits-du-terroir/boissons-177/ - 30k
Note from asker:
| Yes, it is one of the worst sentences in the ms! However, I just didn't think "boil" was correct. (basically my 1st attempt is exactly as you have written.) I was wondering if it could mean "ferment", or "go sour". Perhaps the young man who dictated this knew very little about wine making. |
| Oh, your note about one of the features of new wine is that it bubbles ... the compass needle is floating in a clear or pale amber/yellow oil, correct? So maybe it suddenly got frothy or bubbly, which would have prevented it from showing north correctly. 'course it sounds like hogwash to me...but if the author thinks that's what happened ;-) |
32 mins
Where water is boiling ...
Might there be an old wive's tale that if new wine is taken into a place where water (presumably) is boiling, it will go off?
"quand il (le vin) entre dans l'endroit (un endroit) ou il bout (same construction as "il pleut, il vente", etc. - où qqchose bout)" ??
"quand il (le vin) entre dans l'endroit (un endroit) ou il bout (same construction as "il pleut, il vente", etc. - où qqchose bout)" ??
Note from asker:
| This is an interesting idea. Let's see if anyone can corroborate. |
Discussion
This is why "la chèvre" a local Savoie specialty gives a bubbly/carbonated white wine.